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| Main / Discussions / Formation Rebalancing Search Forum | |
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hosh13
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posted: 2013-04-19 14:49:16 (ID: 92131) Report Abuse |
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Nogard wrote:
cause it is exactly because of what you say. You think the 4WR is mostly a pass offense. That means you expect a heavy pass from this formation and set as defensive coordinator the playbook at heavy pass defense. And now your opponent runs and your heavy pass defense failed. So long runs are expected. It based on the fact that it is no real time coaching game. where you can react during a game. If you set the wrong defense you have to live with it and try it the next time better. The Ds do react - the more you run the better they play the run and vice versa. As I said in another thread, the D bias should be about 80% pass at the start of a game vs the SG4WR. If a team runs regularly from that formation then the D bias moves to about 50% pass and should be shutting down the run at that point imo. |
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KingOfTh3Hil
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posted: 2013-04-19 14:59:58 (ID: 92133) Report Abuse |
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Nogard wrote:
I have the complete opposite data King. I used SG4 and SG2 very often last season. My 3 FB have 0.5-1.0 yrds less in avg yrds than my lower skilled RBs. 5.9 avg FB1 - 569 rushes 6.0 avg FB2 (sometimes RB) -453 rushes 5.3 avg FB3 - 242 rushes - - - - 6.8 avg RB1 - 149 rushes 6.1 avg RB2 - 119 rushes 7.4 avg RB3 (as oop FB) - 17 rushes If I look only at league games overall I can only compare 1 FB 5.5 avg on 1060 rushes and 1 RB on 6.1 avg on 292 rushes so, low skilled players is better then the trained ones  |
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dgrid
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posted: 2013-04-19 14:59:58 (ID: 92134) Report Abuse |
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hosh13 wrote:
What I really don't like is how a 4WR formation can run on a regular basis with success. Such a formation would typically pass the ball irl and might end up with a decent run avg since the D is not expecting the *odd* run. IMO. if you ran on a regular basis out of such a formation you'd get killed, even if it was the Dime. Unprotected backs should get tackled for a loss a lot. Dont forget IRL, WRs can block. And the dime vs runs usually doesnt work so great, since only 1 LBer (unless 3-2 dime). Nickel might be a different story tho. 4-wide creates alot of space and running lanes for the faster RBs. |
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holmeboy
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posted: 2013-04-19 15:15:06 (ID: 92137) Report Abuse |
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If a FB has high carrying and agility there's no reason he can't be as successful as a RB with the same skills. The only issue I had was with FBs with <10 blocking being too good at stopping blitzers.
I share a lot of the same sentiments as JonnyP here. Imo not sure improving the Dime v the run was the way to go (if thats what happened). |
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bwadders76
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posted: 2013-04-19 15:20:38 (ID: 92138) Report Abuse |
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My stats in the league last season:-
RB1 226 carries 868 yards 3.8 ave RB2 129 carries 494 yards 3.8 ave RB3 61 carries 294 yards 4.8 ave FB1 80 carries 294 yards 3.7 ave FB2 18 carries 67 yards 3.7 ave FB1 is upto 6 points stronger than the three RBs but up to 5.2 slower. POS and VIS are all about equal. CAR FB1 is down by 7 points on two of the RBs but 9 down on the third. FB2 is down on all four other players in all areas by a considerable margin. FB1 and RB2 are the same for AGI which is 2 points up on RB1 and RB3 again FB2 is way down. |
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sfniner08
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posted: 2013-04-19 15:26:26 (ID: 92140) Report Abuse |
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4wrsg still outperformed the single back spread in 8 scrimmages I ran.
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hosh13
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posted: 2013-04-19 17:28:55 (ID: 92166) Report Abuse |
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dgrid wrote:
Dont forget IRL, WRs can block. And the dime vs runs usually doesnt work so great, since only 1 LBer (unless 3-2 dime). Nickel might be a different story tho. 4-wide creates alot of space and running lanes for the faster RBs. Then I'm at a loss to understand why all NFL teams don't run that all the time.  |
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Swordpriest1
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posted: 2013-04-19 18:11:50 (ID: 92175) Report Abuse |
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hosh13 wrote:
dgrid wrote:
Dont forget IRL, WRs can block. And the dime vs runs usually doesnt work so great, since only 1 LBer (unless 3-2 dime). Nickel might be a different story tho. 4-wide creates alot of space and running lanes for the faster RBs. Then I'm at a loss to understand why all NFL teams don't run that all the time. they would if the rules of the game garnered for a better rushing attack. As it stands today you can get way more yards per play with a pass because of the myriad of things that can happen in the positive over the positive of rushing. I'm not sure about the mechanics of this game but in R/L (and you see it all the time in college.. just look at Ore) if you have an offense chalk full of speed than the Spread (no matter shotgun or bullet formation) is your best bet because it can confuse the hell of out the defense. It offers by far the most flexibility. More importantly it forces the defense to play out of their base formation so the experience and skill level definitely tip in the balance of the offense. I'm with JohnnyP on the apprehension on how this will rebalance the formations. I'm one of those "lazy" defensive managers but if I did get showed up because of that slight I wouldnt and couldnt trip over it. I would like the option to audible but I can see the exploits of that as well. What I would like is for the actual coaches to have some imput on in game situations. This whole "If an offense runs 80% of the time out of the SG4W then the defense should adjust accordingly" seems like a prime reason why coaches should REALLY matter after the kick off as well. |
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dgrid
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posted: 2013-04-19 18:20:29 (ID: 92177) Report Abuse |
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hosh13 wrote:
dgrid wrote:
Dont forget IRL, WRs can block. And the dime vs runs usually doesnt work so great, since only 1 LBer (unless 3-2 dime). Nickel might be a different story tho. 4-wide creates alot of space and running lanes for the faster RBs. Then I'm at a loss to understand why all NFL teams don't run that all the time. Well yes, spread offenses need the pass to set up the run obviously, but running with spread offense can be very effective, and is done in the NFL (and college). |
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bv515109
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posted: 2013-04-19 18:28:53 (ID: 92180) Report Abuse |
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Swordpriest1 wrote:
hosh13 wrote:
dgrid wrote:
Dont forget IRL, WRs can block. And the dime vs runs usually doesnt work so great, since only 1 LBer (unless 3-2 dime). Nickel might be a different story tho. 4-wide creates alot of space and running lanes for the faster RBs. Then I'm at a loss to understand why all NFL teams don't run that all the time. they would if the rules of the game garnered for a better rushing attack. As it stands today you can get way more yards per play with a pass because of the myriad of things that can happen in the positive over the positive of rushing. I took that to ask why NFL teams don't run out of a spread out shotgun formation all the time. You'll find some teams actually do, but that's only because some OCs are in love with the gun. The reason most don't is that defenses can be much more versatile and creative in real life. More blitzers, defensive line doing stunts or dropping back in coverage, and tons more can't be simulated by the engine. My understanding is that it can't even really do man coverage. In life, even spreading out the defense doesn't help out the rusher that much. They have no lead blocker, and it is way too easy for them to get blown up for a loss, even against a dime or nickel defense. It's asking way too much of most rushers to do that very often and expect good results. As for the actual rebalancing or whatever, it makes no difference to me. I will just do whatever I feel like regardless |
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