Community - American Football Management Simulator
AdBlocker active? It seems you are using software to block advertisements. You could help us if you could switch it off when visiting redzoneaction.org. The reason is very simple: Advertisements help us running the site, to offer you the game in a good quality for free. So if you like the game, please support us by purchasing a Supporter Account or disabling the AdBlocker on this site. Thank you very much!
Main / Rookie Area / NOOB Questions About Builds, Skills, and Training Search Forum
Navigation: |<   <   1  2  3 16  17  18  >   >|  
Poster Message
HH_KMN
KMN Mandalorians

Germany   HH_KMN owns a supporter account

Joined: 2022-01-21/S46
Posts: 162
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 09:11:03 (ID: 100165716) Report Abuse
jack6 wrote:
sfniner08 wrote:
My question is what do you value more in a qb, speed or strength?

Since it became common to assume speed does prevent sacks while most passes are under 10 yards I think most value high speed over high strength.


however, taking a sack is just more visible than a slight dip in passing quality due to lesser arm strength.
only one man knows for sure and he is historically a tough cookie when it comes down to giving away details

As 50 (+Track Star) speed 50 (+strong arm) strength 50 intelligence guys do not come in bunches,
I would still try to go for Elite speed as speed differential seems to be a good factor in sacks (which was even more visible before a code change, there was a time when 50 + Trackstar QBs were nearly impossible to sack)
However I would want 45 Strength for the ideal QB

my current project has 46 speed and 44 strength and neither Track Star, Strong Arm nor Natural leader, so you will have to settle for less, but I am always trying to find a better project
Quote   Reply   Edit  
sfniner08
Sfniner08

Usa

Joined: 2021-10-20/S44
Posts: 561
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 16:36:59 (ID: 100165720) Report Abuse
Maybe.....if I keep posting.....over.....and over.....and over....I can wear Pete down to reveal if speed really does avoid sacks .......? Lol. If it does it would be strange for speed instead of agility avoiding sacks. In real life speed plays little into avoiding sacks unless you are a running qb that is constantly rolling out of the pocket. Pocket passers don't need speed. You would think strength to shake off a defender and agility to dodge the defender would be more important....
Quote   Reply   Edit  
ablefty33
Dublin Oilers

Ireland   ablefty33 owns a supporter account

Joined: 2020-08-21/S39
Posts: 160
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 20:32:26 (ID: 100165730) Report Abuse
sfniner08 wrote:
Maybe.....if I keep posting.....over.....and over.....and over....I can wear Pete down to reveal if speed really does avoid sacks .......? Lol. If it does it would be strange for speed instead of agility avoiding sacks. In real life speed plays little into avoiding sacks unless you are a running qb that is constantly rolling out of the pocket. Pocket passers don't need speed. You would think strength to shake off a defender and agility to dodge the defender would be more important....


Fast quarterbacks are better quarterbacks here. There's no reason why your fast quarterback can't be strong and agile though.
For the record, however, the top five QBs in times sacked this past season were:

Burrow 51
Tannehill 47
Z. Wilson 44
Mayfield 43
M. Ryan 40

Not really anyone who can run away. There's not a direct correlation here between speed and avoiding sacks, but the lower portion of the rankings has a higher concentration of mobile guys.
Quote   Reply   Edit  
HH_KMN
KMN Mandalorians

Germany   HH_KMN owns a supporter account

Joined: 2022-01-21/S46
Posts: 162
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 20:50:18 (ID: 100165731) Report Abuse
ablefty33 wrote:

Fast quarterbacks are better quarterbacks here. There's no reason why your fast quarterback can't be strong and agile though.
For the record, however, the top five QBs in times sacked this past season were:

Burrow 51
Tannehill 47
Z. Wilson 44
Mayfield 43
M. Ryan 40

Not really anyone who can run away. There's not a direct correlation here between speed and avoiding sacks, but the lower portion of the rankings has a higher concentration of mobile guys.


The speedy Peyton Manning and Dan Marino leed the NFL in lowest Sack Rate per Pass attempt, which should lead to the guess that pre Snap Recognition and quick release are way more important in avoiding sacks then footspeed

pro Football reference
Quote   Reply   Edit  
sfniner08
Sfniner08

Usa

Joined: 2021-10-20/S44
Posts: 561
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 20:56:02 (ID: 100165732) Report Abuse
In the NFL your oline also plays a big role. The previous year in 2020 the top 3 qb's sacked were Wentz 50, Watson 49, Wilson 47. All 3 of then being a mobile QB. Hard to come up with a correlation either way.
Quote   Reply   Edit  
sfniner08
Sfniner08

Usa

Joined: 2021-10-20/S44
Posts: 561
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 21:01:58 (ID: 100165733) Report Abuse
I think if you want to run your qb then speed is very important, but it you are pocket passer it doesn't make sense that speed helps you miss sacks. Agility is what causes you to be able to sidestep and move around the pocket. In real life it is the agility not the speed, what I am asking here is if it is the same or is speed working differently in the engine than it would in real life.

To be clear, I'm not saying it is wrong or right if it is speed in the engine that avoids sacks instead of agility and strength. I just want to know so that I'm not missing some important detail.

I know Yoda does not want to give too much away but in this instance it might be a good idea so that people who are new aren't making the same assumption based off what they have seen in the real life version of the game.

Only Yoda knows and if he wants to divulge that is fine if not then we carry on. lol
Quote   Reply   Edit  
ptdoc2017
Sunrise City Prairie Dogs

Usa   ptdoc2017 owns a supporter account

Joined: 2017-05-16/S25
Posts: 789
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 21:11:15 (ID: 100165734) Report Abuse
I don't think there's a simple answer, as several factors are likely in play. But to make it as simple as possible, my 50 Spd + Track Star QBs get sacked less often than any of my slower QBs. Last season, my QB was 50 Str + Strong Arm, and 50 Spd, and he got sacked quite a bit, because in Elite, I think the vast majority of LBs are 50+ Spd
Quote   Reply   Edit  
sfniner08
Sfniner08

Usa

Joined: 2021-10-20/S44
Posts: 561
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 21:38:33 (ID: 100165736) Report Abuse
Your 50/50 qb is superior in every stat has more sacks but also far more plays to be sacked. Also, last season one qb was in 26 games while the other was in 15. Did your 50/50 guy play the tougher games? That could play a role too. It wouldn't make sense for your 50/50 qb to be worse at avoiding sacks compared to a player with same speed and less strength and agility.

In any case that isn't enough of a sample size. I already looked at the Elite division and there isn't anything clear there either. In fact the top 5 sacked qbs had different factors that could have contributed to the sacks. One had poor agility, a couple were below 46 in speed and strength, one had low strength and high speed, while the 5th was high in all areas.

Perhaps that is answer enough, it depends on more than just speed or strength or agility or oline or fb or formation or playbook rather it has to be a combination of all of them.

I have to conclude it is false to assume that speed or strength/agility is superior. There are just too many factors at play. The only way to narrow it down in regards to build is to have a large data sample or Yoda tell it. I have yet to see any large data sample posted here so I have to conclude that the speed idea was born from a group of people who came to a conclusion of what they saw from their own squads.
Quote   Reply   Edit  
ablefty33
Dublin Oilers

Ireland   ablefty33 owns a supporter account

Joined: 2020-08-21/S39
Posts: 160
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 21:44:35 (ID: 100165738) Report Abuse
sfniner08 wrote:
I think if you want to run your qb then speed is very important, but it you are pocket passer it doesn't make sense that speed helps you miss sacks. Agility is what causes you to be able to sidestep and move around the pocket. In real life it is the agility not the speed, what I am asking here is if it is the same or is speed working differently in the engine than it would in real life.

To be clear, I'm not saying it is wrong or right if it is speed in the engine that avoids sacks instead of agility and strength. I just want to know so that I'm not missing some important detail.

I know Yoda does not want to give too much away but in this instance it might be a good idea so that people who are new aren't making the same assumption based off what they have seen in the real life version of the game.

Only Yoda knows and if he wants to divulge that is fine if not then we carry on. lol


Yoda has said more than once that agility is important for every position. And again, you aren't forced to choose between speed, strength, agility.
I'm not arguing against the idea of pocket passers, but we're not playing Madden here, I don't think it's quite that complex a formula that you can have Ben Roethlisberger shaking off linebackers.
A fast qb with solid strength and good agility seems to be the way to go.
I don't mean any of this argumentatively, for the record.
Quote   Reply   Edit  
sfniner08
Sfniner08

Usa

Joined: 2021-10-20/S44
Posts: 561
Top Manager



 
posted: 2022-03-03 21:55:23 (ID: 100165741) Report Abuse
It is all good, not taking it as argumentatively. I'm just trying to sort out how it works. Yes of course we would all want the qb to be 50/50 with high agility. Being they don't pop up all that often as a qb I was trying to determine if I had to choose between two qb's who were similar but one was capped lower in speed vs one lower in strength would it matter so much.

That was my initial wondering....

Then the matter of speed has popped up through messages to me from individuals and from what I've read from some people on the forum. It caused me to pause on the idea in my head I've had about QB builds. I then was questioning if the idea of speed was in fact true or if it has manifested through word of mouth. If it is the former I just wanted to verify it but if it is the latter then I guess I would question it a bit.

Look, not earth shattering and not going to change the world , but I still wanted to know and have now realized I have perhaps spent more time on this than necessary and could have been doing something else! lol.
Quote   Reply   Edit  
reply   Mark this thread unread
Navigation: |<   <   1  2  3 16  17  18  >   >|  
Main / Rookie Area / NOOB Questions About Builds, Skills, and Training